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POLITIFACT, October 4, 2012 -- President Barack Obama’s health care law includes a mighty powerful board that will dictate treatment decisions for Medicare patients, said Mitt Romney at the Oct. 3 debate in Denver. When explaining why he opposed the health care law, Romney said Barack Obama "put in place a board that can tell people ultimately what treatments they're going to receive." He also said this: "And then he has as a model for doing that a board of people at the government, an unelected board, appointed board, who are going to decide what kind of treatment you ought to have." And later: "In order to bring the cost of health care down, we don't need to have a board of 15 people telling us what kinds of treatments we should have." Obama refuted Romney’s remark, saying, "Let me just point out first of all this board that we're talking about can't make decisions about what treatments are given." For this fact-check, we will focus on Romney’s statement about whether the unelected board -- formally called the Independent Payments Advisory board, or IPAB for short -- can tell people what kind of treatments they can have. We’ve previously checked a whole slew of claims about the health care law and the IPAB. Many of the variations of Romney’s claim have been in false territory -- depending on the wording -- including a Pants on Fire for Pat Boone who said the board "can ration care and deny certain Medicare treatments." (That was one of our Top 5 falsehoods on the health care law.) We gave a Mostly False to Paul Ryan who said that the "unelected, unaccountable" board created by the health care law "will lead to denied care for current seniors." We will note up front that Romney used somewhat softer words than some other critics of the board in that he didn’t use the words "ration" or "unaccountable." IPAB CANNOT RATION CARE, RESTRICT BENEFITS OR MAKE HEALTH TREATMENT DECISIONS FOR INDIVIDUALS: SECTION 3403 OF HEALTH CARE LAW. We will borrow from our previous items to explain the board and Romney’s claim. Some of our information comes from the Kaiser Family Foundation, a nonprofit, nonpartisan group that studies health care, which put out a primer in 2010 about the board and a longer paper in 2011. The health care law directs a new national board — with 15 members who are political appointees — to identify Medicare savings. It's forbidden from submitting "any recommendation to ration health care," as Section 3403 of the health care law states. It may not raise premiums for Medicare beneficiaries or increase deductibles, coinsurance or co-payments. The IPAB also cannot change who is eligible for Medicare, restrict benefits or make recommendations that would raise revenue. What it can do is reduce how much the government pays health care providers for services, reduce payments to hospitals with very high rates of re-admissions or recommend innovations that cut wasteful spending. Some argue that because the IPAB can reduce the money a doctor receives, this could lead to an indirect form of rationing. But the board wouldn't make any health care decisions for individual Americans. Instead, as PolitiFact Georgia reported, it would make broad policy decisions that affect Medicare's overall cost. For this fact-check, a Romney campaign spokesman sent us a 2011 POLITICO article that largely focused on the challenges of filling the spots on the board, which the headline described as "Medicare cost-cutting job could be worst in D.C." The article mentioned that Republicans have portrayed it as rationing care, but that the law prohibits the board from rationing health care. OUR RULING When Romney was talking about the Independent Payment Advisory Board and Medicare, he said, Barack Obama "put in place a board that can tell people ultimately what treatments they're going to receive." He avoided the more inaccurate and harsher wording of some other critics, who have falsely described the board as "rationing" care. But Romney’s claim can leave viewers with the impression that the board will sit around a table and talk about whether grandpa can get his bypass or not, and that’s not the case. The board can reduce how much the government pays health care providers for services, reduce payments to hospitals with very high rates of re-admissions or recommend innovations that cut wasteful spending. And there are questions about whether that could lead to different treatment decisions, but Romney's comments give a misleading impression. We rate his statement MOSTLY FALSE.
Posted By: Richard Kigel
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 3:13PM
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ROMNEY SAYS OBAMACARE “BOARD CAN TELL PEOPLE WHAT TREATMENTS THEY CAN RECEIVE.” POLTIFACT SAYS: “MOSTLY FALSE.” POLITIFACT, October 4, 2012 -- When Romney was talking about the Independent Payment Advisory Board and Medicare at the Oct. 3 debate in Denver, he said, Barack Obama "put in place a board that can tell people ultimately what treatments they're going to receive." But Romney’s claim can leave viewers with the impression that the board will sit around a table and talk about whether grandpa can get his bypass or not, and that’s not the case. The board can reduce how much the government pays health care providers for services, reduce payments to hospitals with very high rates of re-admissions or recommend innovations that cut wasteful spending. By law the board is prohibited from rationing care, restricting benefits or making health treatment decisions for individuals. Romney's comments give a misleading impression. We rate his statement MOSTLY FALSE. http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/st...
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 3:14PM
Richard Kigel
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It's sad that we are debating about health care, but I do hope it's more like the European health care system and not like the Canadian one. The Canadian Health Care system SUCKS!
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 6:21PM
Jen Fad
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My pastor is a Brit. I asked her about the NHS after the amazing 20 minute tribute at the London Olympics. She told me that they love their Health Care System--it's all totally free. That makes going to the doctor so simple.
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 7:31PM
Richard Kigel
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The NHS is so much more efficient than the Canadian system with all their wait times. People in Canada have to wait for 2 - 3 weeks some times for surgeries like hip surgery and back surgery. People are going out of the country to get surgeries and procedures done, because of the wait. The first thing that comes out of a Candian's mouth when one tells them about the long wait times, "It's better than the one in the States." Says who? I think the system of Canada sucks. There are more than 10,000 people in NOva Scotia waiting for gastric bypass surgery. The dirty Canadian secret is... "go South (to the USA) of the Border" but don't tell no body. The wait times are really pathetic and the Candians don't complain because they are "so polite". ((REALLY))
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 8:43PM
Jen Fad
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Wait Times for Cardiac Surgery in Ontario Bypass Surgery| Target:182 days [Jun-Jul-Aug12]View shortest wait times in the province for this service Hospital Name Wait time (days) Provincial Wait Time (9 out of 10 patients complete their procedures in this time) 47 Hamilton Niagara Haldimand Brant (HNHB) 33 South East 33 South West 35 Waterloo Wellington 35 Toronto Central 38 Mississauga Halton 46 Central 55 Champlain 63 http://waittimes.hco-on.ca/en/search/surge...
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 8:49PM
Jen Fad
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Here is an example of one hospital... with the wait time for Endometrial Ablation which is a Gynaecologic Surgery Provincial Wait Time (9 out of 10 patients complete their procedures in this time) 128 William Osler Health Centre 118 (days) http://www.waittimes.net/surgerydi/en/Data... Cancer Surgery Breast Cancer| Target:84 days [Jun-Jul-Aug12] Provincial Wait Time (9 out of 10 patients complete their procedures in this time) 36 Sunnybrook Health Sciences Centre ** Special note Toronto 46 http://www.waittimes.net/surgerydi/en/Data...
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 8:53PM
Jen Fad
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In a sense, I'd say that to some folk those wait times are likened to death panels... waiting for surgery for what?! One can die of a massive heart attack by the time they can surgery, wouldn't you think so? Besides, I came across this article on the internet... have a look and pray that ObamaCare will not be like this... The public policy question is whether or not paying for health-care services fairly amorphously through taxation – both income taxes and sales taxes – leaves individuals oblivious to their own health-care costs. In other words, do they overuse care, going to the emergency room for a tummy ache or a hangnail, for example, because it’s “free”? There are a lot of inefficiencies but there is actually little evidence that Canadians overuse the system. The long waits for care, both in emergency rooms and in booking physician visits, actually discourage abuse. And let’s not forget that problems like overuse of emergency rooms are a symptom of bad structure and management, not a proof that Canadians are health-care spendthrifts. Actually, Canada's Health Care Isn't Free http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/health...
Thursday, October 4th 2012 at 9:22PM
Jen Fad
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I understand your point; however, if you are insured either Medicare or private Insurance, there should be no waiting like in Ontario or other Provinces in Canada. Sister Irma, count your blessings that you are in the States. Healthcare is different in Canada and that difference isn''t that its better. I'm sorry, but at least you are free and encouraged to get second opinions. The doctors are as thorough there in Canada because they don't get sued often like in the States. Medical professions here carry malpractice insurance and are overly cautious to over diagnose or work up a patient to be sure things don't get missed. Do you have private insurance or a combination of private and Medicare/Medicaid?
Friday, October 5th 2012 at 3:33PM
Jen Fad
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Well Jen, there is a tradeoff--yes, for medical treatment you have to wait. But you don't pay out of your own pocket. The reason why this is better is that for milllions who do not have health insurance and who not go to the doctor because they can't afford to--until they have an medical emergency, that amounts to "wait time." Here in the US, you might be able to have surgery sooner--but you will have to fight your insurance company over what they will cover--and too often you have to pay thousands of dolloars. So that's the trade off--longer wait times for less cost.
Friday, October 5th 2012 at 4:40PM
Richard Kigel
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Great story, Irma. I am very happy to hear that you have medical insurance. Fortunately!!!
Friday, October 5th 2012 at 10:59PM
Richard Kigel
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@ Sister Irma, Again as usual, I agree to disagree with you as well as Bro. Rich for which I hardly ever disagree with as he and I are usually on the same page. Our neighbor's system to the North of us is not the best and in fact, the govt there is looking for more efficient ways of managing their Universal Health Care as its taking up more than half of the Provincial Govt's budget. The problem with their system is that its not efficient and even if you have access to doctor, one may die still if you don't have a plan in place to pay for the meds (yes as cheap as we think their meds may be compared to ours). In addition to that, one may also die waiting for surgery or treatment because someon says that the treatment we need isn't as urgent as the next guys's need... yet everyone pays into the system. I'm not sure about you all, but I don't need anyone deciding when I should have my surgery. In addition to this, their doctors most came South of the Border to the States before the Universal HealthCare took effect because they want to be paid a good income; therefore, causing a shortage of family doctors. There are so many things I could say, but I doubt I can convince you guys as you have already made up your minds. Paying 13 to 15 % on every dollar for items in Ontario isn't a treat for a system that priorities who will have a surgery. I'm sorry but those WAIT TIMES SUCK! The docotors are overloaded and underpaid so they see more patients to make the money and they don't really diagnose and treat as well as medical doctors in the States. Their is no real quality in my opinon so if that's what you guys advocate then SHAME on you both. Yes, Irma I'm rather a Conservative but to each its own.
Saturday, October 6th 2012 at 5:01PM
Jen Fad
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And yes, Sister Irma I AM A NURSE and a Very Good One at that... so it not that I'm saying that we shouldn't have a more equitable system, but I think the American people should think more about how we are going to go about it. Look at various Universal Health Care systems in order to listen to the encumbent and the hopeful Presidential candidates in order to find out what they want to do. That's my point. Hopefully it will be affordable and won't be grievious like the Canadian Health Care System with all the inefficiencies and LONG LONG LONG wait times. Oh and Canadian's pay out of the wazoo for Health Care (13% on every dollar in Ontario) which makes no sense for an inefficient system. You go to any border of the States and Canada on the weekend and see the long line ups where these Canucks are waiting patiently to cross to buy cheaper, quality American products.
Saturday, October 6th 2012 at 5:07PM
Jen Fad
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Jen--Well you are the resident expert in health care around here...you certainly have first hand knoweldge and experience and there is no way I can argue with you on it. I can't say anything about the Canadian system. And all I know about the British system is what I read and what my Brit friends tell me. I can say plenty about the ridiculous, insane, inhuman and totally unreliable health care system we have here--which is based on PROFIT and rationing care (it's the Insurance companies that do it not the gov't). I can tell you how I watched one of my very good friends on the phone arguing with her insurance company to cover drugs she needed to extend her life. Another friend was frantically trying to persuade her insurance company to authoroize her cancer treatments--and had to wait past the date the doctors gave her until it was finally approved. And there are many many stories like it. I know enough about our system in the US to say that it sucks. I would be very surprised if you did not agree with that.
Saturday, October 6th 2012 at 6:14PM
Richard Kigel
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@ Brother Rich, [I can say plenty about the ridiculous, insane, inhuman and totally unreliable health care system we have here--which is based on PROFIT and rationing care (it's the Insurance companies that do it not the gov't).] I know both health systems and having private insurance or a combination (Medicare/Medicaid) is far better than the single payer system done in Canada. Trust me when I say that Canada has its own version of the HMOs or Insurance companies such as in Ontario; they are called Local Health Integration Networks (LHINs). LHINs provide the delivery of operational public healthcare services by geographic region distributed by the Community Care Access Centres (CCAC). Also ... dental and medications are NOT paid for under the Canadian Universal Health Care as well as some procedures aren't covered. There are limitations. In some Providences, there is a fee that is paid by the people seeking care upfront. I'm really sorry for what happened to your friend(s); however, I believe that Universal Health Care under President Obama will eliminate some of those instances, but probably not all. It is my hope that we aren't making a precedent for Government interference into our affairs. As far as the Insurance companies go or HMO's, these gained their power under ex President Bill Clinton because of the amount of spending on health care in the 1990's. When the reason was investigated, it was found that there was alot of fraud going on with upcoding, double billing, and billing for procedures and tests that weren't done by physicians, hospitals, and pharmacies alike. As a result, we have what we have now. For me, I prefer the American system both to be hospitalized and to care for patients. As far as Mitt Romney and Ryan, I don't believe the unelected board rationing care, but in a sense that's what happens (in Canada). Canada's system is not aggresive at treatment at all, because the whole thing is conservation of resources trying the least expensive treatment first (even though a medical doctor knows it won't work) then try the most expensive. By that time, precious time has been lost.
Saturday, October 6th 2012 at 10:00PM
Jen Fad
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Sister Irma, What do you really know about Canada? You don't really know the Canadian system and can't speak on it because you've never lived there, have you? Most Americans probably don't know where Canada is so I doubt that you really understand the Canadian Health Care system. You have no idea what you're talking about so I will let you continue to think that the as you put it in your own Buddhist words ...."'THIS BULL **** ABOUT SHORTAGE OF DOCTORS..." isn't true. How spiritual you are here, eh! ((Lol)) Miss Irma kindly do a google or a fact check before dismissing the Canadian shortage of doctors. Why don't I Educate, Educate, Educate YOU>>>>>> Canada's Doctor Shortage Will Only Worsen in the Coming Decade March 20, 2011 [When stacked up against countries with similar health care goals, namely universal coverage, it quickly becomes apparent that Canada’s health care system is not worth emulating. While we’re a top spender, we have among the longest waiting lists, low levels of medical technologies and perhaps the problem that hits closest to home, a short supply of doctors. If you think it’s bad now, just wait. Over the next decade, the physician shortage will become more severe. Even if government imposed restrictions on the number of doctors being trained in Canada are immediately removed, it won’t have an ... ] Click link to cont >>>>> http://www.fraserinstitute.org/publication... As for the Public option, I'm watching and waiting to see what the ends gonna be. I'm a nurse and I have my opinion of what I believe is effective as well as efficient health care. The poor are always with us and I do believe that my taxes are paying for the least of my brothren. I'm doing my civic duty and my Christian duties not only with my taxes, but in my work taking care of the 'least of my brethren'.
Sunday, October 7th 2012 at 4:34PM
Jen Fad
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(((Hello))) did you really have to make me take IT there, eh?
Sunday, October 7th 2012 at 4:37PM
Jen Fad
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Hey Jen-- That was one of the clearest, most concise, informed, thoughtful and insightful description of the health care situation I have seen anywhere. I would love to see you adding your observations to the debate--have you considered writing something for publication, an article for a newspaper or magazine? You are a powerful health care advocate--your voice is too valuable. You need a MEGAPHONE!!!
Sunday, October 7th 2012 at 4:43PM
Richard Kigel
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@ Brother Rich, As a matter of fact, I have thought of writing to The Huffington Post regards other issues, but not necessarily the Health Care Debate. I believe you have just planted a 'seed'! Thanks for the encouragement and I'm glad that you found the article link I posted insightful.
Monday, October 8th 2012 at 7:06AM
Jen Fad
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And Sister Irma, I accept your APOLOGY even if you don't come out and say YOU PUT YOUR FOOT IN YOUR MOUTH~Ha! The truth is you don't know everything and it would be good for you to educate, Educate, EDUCATE yourself on things you aren't certain of before speaking, because AGE doesn't necessarily make you WISE. We can all learn from others. Once again, I Accept Your Apology and I forgive you. Your 'sins' are forgiven.
Monday, October 8th 2012 at 7:12AM
Jen Fad
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Hey Jen--GO FOR IT!!! I would LOVE to see it! You certainly have an important voice--and you have . Share your wisdom--and please---let me know if you actually do. And seriously--if you would like some editorial help with it, don't forget--I am a writing professional. I would love to help you any way I can. Tell them what you think!!!
Monday, October 8th 2012 at 12:12PM
Richard Kigel
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@ Bro. Rich, I do plan to utilze your expertise so be looking for me! Thanks for the encouragement. And Sister Irma you are my nemesis but at the same time I can count on you to squeeze "Juicy" hard to search my brain for the things that allow us all to learn from one another.
Tuesday, October 9th 2012 at 11:26AM
Jen Fad
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Brother Cow, if I may go off topic...my definition of a conservative is... 1. Someone who is totally against any thing to help the lease of our brothern. 2.When you have heard one you have heard them all as they are like machines using the same talking poitns as 'programed to say.(how many times have I heard these same rationals for not allowing equal insurance from Romney & M. Bachmann to Sean Hannity to Sarah Palin...) 3. If all else fails they will call you a sinner. LOL!!!(smile)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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Dialogue is always the enemy of a small mind... EDUCATE!!!EDUCATE!!!EDUCATE!!! (SMILE)... @Rich, great blog lead in for Nov.6...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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Romney always says "taxes"...great if you can get most people to over look a 5 year old pays 'taxes' on things they buy... OK Romney, did youpay any income taxes in 2010? LOL!!! IS THE QUESTION BEING ASKED BY SENATOR REID... VARIABLES, VARIABLES, VARIABLES V BRAINWASHINGS...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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...3. "IF ALL ELSE FAIL, THEY WILL CALL YOU A SINNER"... (ROTFLMPROUD BLACKAO)(S-M-I-L-E)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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...what "I" am trying to get acros is that it all ends up being about the almighty$$$$$$$$$$$ and a doctor gets into major, major debt, years of training and most deserve every penny they get...but to have surgery today you must see at least two or more doctors because of the specializing and the room to do an operation to how popular that doctor is must be brought into the equasion or facts over emotions of pros and cons. then after all of this you may get out of the hospital less than a full day after your major, major operation to boot, maybe fever and all!!! (NUP!!!)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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...AND, JEN YOUR BEING A NURSE YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER THAN ANYONE THAT YOU MUST SIGN OR THERE BE A COURT ORDER BEFORE ANYONE CAN OPERATE ON ANYONE..OS WHAT IS THIS ABOUT YOU DON'T WANT ANYONE DECIDING YOU GETTING AN OPERATION???YOU DID TALK ABOUT MALPRACTICE DID YOU NOT...THIS BULL **** ABOUT SHORTAGE OF DOCTORS...THE WAY FOR A NEW DOCTOR TO GET STARTED IS TO TAKE MEDICAL, MEDICARE PATIENTS AND NYONE ELSE TO HELP PAY OFFICE SPACE FOR THEM...AGAIN JUST EVERYDAY COAMMON SENSE. (NUP/ SMILE)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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...OH, AND AGAIN THE 'PUBLIC OPTION' IS ONLY ASKING FOR THE SAME KINDS OF INSURANCE FOR THE AVERAGE AMERICAN CITIZEN AS OUR POLITICIANS IN D.C VOTE AGAINST THAT IS ALL...OR JUST TO OBEY/ ENFORCE BVBOE WHICH IS TO TREAT ALL THE SAME IN AMERICA... AS THEY DO IN CANADA... (S-M-I-L-E)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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@Jen, please don't think as usual that I am doing anything except speaking of my own experiences which never is trying to trinvent anyone as I see everyone as an individual...so "I" shall repeat, my life is priceless and I demand a doctor that has time for me, period. I see a doctor not as a giver of life nor a taker of life. Some doctors see patient as a number, a $$ sign and some see the patient as a humanbeing that his put all of their trust and faith in him or her and will do the best for them.example, my eye doctor foe free surgerys if one can pvove they can not pay. My doctors will make sure he talks with my family if theyare concerned or wnats information tocalm them down.Wehn my sister wh had lou gruet desese we all chipped in with our own insurances to pay for the 24/7 car she needed for the 10 years beyond her expected linght of time for living with this desease. Every thing is not about the $$$$$$$$, but about care, the best care that can be had...so where I am concerned if a doctor is free, if I am not comfortable with him/ her, don't trust them, I will reject the treatments. but, I will stand by the only way taht I know someone can get a date in ahospital for surgury is by way of a doctor and by the heart test and other test that says it is safe to operate on said person...be it free of cost money. (smile) "I" have a cousin who needs a hip replacement, but can't get it because her blood pressure is too low...she has insurance to pay for it but not a doctor to do the operation...VARIABLES THAT CAN BE COVERED UP DUE TO WHAT I CALL BRAINWASHINGS AS IN FINDING EXCUSES TO AVOID FACTS OVER THE BLAME GAME...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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Well is this the 2012 version of Palin's 2008 death panels?!? (nup)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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@Jen, son't the Canadians hve what we call the Public Option that has everyone of their citizens covered like our politicians in D.C. are covered by their health care? (smile)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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@RICH, remember my saying in my blogs on Changing poison into medicne when I said my three doctors treating my lung cancer were on the same board and they had been discussing my treatments...needless to say I thought of tis when romney was trying to turn tis into a 'death panel'...like these pain sots causing these deaths lately due to menigitus, sure doctors are involved, but it is not because of malpractice nor just because it is the states therefore again there are just toomany variables in medicnes like nay other profession... WE ARE DEALING WITH HUMAN BEHAVIOR NO MATTER WHERE WE GET TREATED AT AND I WANT TEST DONE AND BEING TALKED TO ABOUT MY ILLNESS WHICH AGAIN TAKES TIME AND MONEY... WE WILL GET THE PUBLIC OPTION SOONER THEN LATER IN AMERICA, BECAUSE WE ARE A NATION THAT DOES CARE ABOUT IT SMOST NEEDY, WE JUST HAVE TO BE REMINDED OF THIS EVERYSO MANY GENERATIONS WHICH IS GOOD FOR ALL OF US. (SMILE)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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Jen, please you are a nurse are you trying to tell me a patient just comes into your hospital and tell them they are short of time, even if a $billionaire, and they just get what they want without a doctor's say so or their doctor even having a liscense topractice there... SURE, I REALISE THAT YOU BEING A CONSERVATIVE SEE THE NEED FOR LESS REGULATIONS AS IN GOVERNMENT'S PLAYIN A PART IN WHO GETS WHAT LICENSE, BUT THERE ARE STILL RULES AND REGULATIONS WHICH IS JUST EVERYDAY COMMONSENSE... NOW TO SOMEONE LIKE ME, MU LIFE IS PRICELESS AND i WANT, DEMAND THE BEST AND I FOLLOW HIS OR HER RULES NO MATTER HOW LONG IT TAKES AS I CHOSE THEM AS THE EXPERT, PERIOD!!!!BE IT CANADA OR AMERICA AS BOTH ARE PLACES AND NOT DOCTORS...AND, I REPEAT JEN YOU ARE A NURSE AND ARE YOU SAYING YOUR HOSPITAL THE DOCTORS DON'T MAKE THE SHEDUALS FOR THE PATIENTS YOU SEE THERE?!? PLEASE, (SMILE) JEN, I HAVE THE INSURANCE THAT ALMOST DON'T EXIST ANY MORE IN AMERICA, REMEMBER IT IS ABOUT THE ALMIGHT $$$$$$$$ TODAY NOT IN THE PAST...MY INSURANCE MUST PAY WHICH IS A BLESSING AND A BENIFIT IN MY BEING MY AGE TO BE CCOMING FORM A TIME WHEN ENEN INSURANCES CARED ABOUT THEIR COUSTMERS...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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Not to argure the point, but since most doctors 'specialize' there are quite a few hoops one must get through before getting sometimes simple surgery. for major surgery it needs maybe a first and even a third doctor's check by a patient, then you must get to be seen if you cn even have surgery by maybe another specialist...cna anyone say all must be done by appointments???... jen, do you remember my mentioning the heart test where they did this great xray and i was able to hear, see my heart,,,well the bill for this one test to see if I could have to even be in condition ot see the lung biopsy cost almost $3,000 and tis was just one of the heart test I had to get on different appointment days,,then there were two more doctors to see in this matter...my daughter who is a nurse, remember my telling how she said the east coast don't take all of this time to get her mom into surgery so come home? (smile)
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
ROBINSON IRMA
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