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THE OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALS.....

Cynthia Merrill Artis · Friday, January 25th 2013 at 3:52PM · 2215 views
Negro Spirituals

In the decades before the Civil War, enslaved African Americans created diverse forms of music, including work songs, field hollers, and spirituals, that would leave a powerful imprint on later forms of American music: on gospel, ragtime, jazz, rhythm and blues, rock and roll, and rap.

One of the most significant musical forms was the spiritual. During the late 18th and early 19th century, many African Americans converted to Christianity, but they reshaped the religion to meet their distinctive needs and blended it with traditions carried from Africa.

Drawing on stories from the Old and New Testament, the spirituals dealt with religious themes-faith, freedom, hope and salvation. They expressed sorrow over life in bondage, but also hope in a better life. Frederick Douglass, the fugitive slave who would become one of this country's leading abolitionists, described the significance of the spirituals with these words:

They would sing words which to many would seem unmeaning jargon, but which nevertheless, were full of meaning to themselves. I have sometimes thought that the mere hearing of those songs would do more to impress some minds with the horrible character of slavery than the reading of whole volumes of philosophy. I did not, when a slave, understand the deep meaning of those songs. They told a tale of woe which was then altogether beyond my feeble comprehension; they were tones loud, long, and deep; they breathed the prayer and complaint of souls boiling over with the bitterest anguish. Every tone was a testimony against slavery and a prayer to God for deliverance from chains...Slaves sing most when they are most unhappy. The songs of the slave represent the sorrows of his heart; and he is relieved by them, only as an aching heart is relieved by its tears.

Spirituals also contained hidden transcripts. In coded language, they offered practical advice about escaping from slavery.

What did Frederick Douglass mean when he wrote the following words about the spirituals?

I have often been utterly astonished, since I came to the north, to find persons who could speak of the singing, among slaves, as evidence of their contentment and happiness. It is impossible to conceive of a greater mistake. Slaves sing most when they are most unhappy. The songs of the slave represent the sorrows of his heart; and he is relieved by them, only as an aching heart is relieved by its tears. At least, such is my experience. I have often sung to drown my sorrow, but seldom to express my happiness. Crying for joy, and singing for joy, were alike uncommon to me while in the jaws of slavery. The singing of a man cast away upon a desolate island might be as appropriately considered as evidence of contentment and happiness, as the singing of a slave; the songs of the one and of the other are prompted by the same emotion.

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Comments (55)

Cynthia Merrill Artis Friday, January 25th 2013 at 3:53PM

YOU GOTTA KNOW ABOUT THIS.... To appreciate it....

My grandmother used to play this all the time...

Cynthia Merrill Artis Friday, January 25th 2013 at 5:40PM

right on time! yep... I'm just sitting here thinkin about those good ole days...

DAVID JOHNSON Friday, January 25th 2013 at 6:19PM

she sang this song !

Gregory V. Boulware, Esq. Friday, January 25th 2013 at 8:16PM

/*
Marion Williams' rendition of "...In My Soul' is extraordinarily performed!

I am also taken back to many reminders of "Those Old Negro Spirituals." My Great-Grandmother and Grandmother used to fill the house with songs like these, primarily on Friday nights and all day Sunday - espeacially if they didn't go to (Church) Sunday Meeting...

What a profound topic... Beautifully written and posted, while the Beautiful performance by Sister Williams enhanced the title and lifted the SOUL!

Nice work Cynthia! :-)

Peace and Love,

Greg.
*/
You can count on this one being 'Tweeted!"

Harry Watley Friday, January 25th 2013 at 9:28PM

Hello to all,

We need to move past the good old days and focus on our future as a sovereign people in a country of our own am I right.

We were crying out back then and now God has answered our prayers. We are going to become a sovereign people in my life-time. What better blessing could God give us than to have a country of our own and some brains to go with it?

DAVID JOHNSON Friday, January 25th 2013 at 9:49PM

SIS ,,you've been hijacked !

Harry Watley Friday, January 25th 2013 at 10:08PM

Hello David,

No David there is any hijacking going on. You all are getting light. We have been in darkness for 500 years now am I right.

DAVID JOHNSON Friday, January 25th 2013 at 10:11PM

you been blocked ,,,your a nuance ,,,you are one dumb ***** !

Gregory V. Boulware, Esq. Friday, January 25th 2013 at 10:17PM

/*
Damn! Is there any peace among the living? - Can't even have a calm, simple and enjoyable conversation! Why must we incessantly be harrassed by this pseudopod with his rancourus sagacity?

Allow me to reiterate... We are not the only ones viewing the 'Black In America' Web Site! This silly ass nonsense is extremely embarrassing to Black Folk! Many have professed to helping Black Folk and being proud to be Black Folk - how could you when the continuation of this attrition to the loud augmented ringing of a knell...leading to our possible demise on Internet venues..."Then *****s sho don know how to behave, they just keeps on ****tin on an killin one anudder!"

"We Shall Overcome" this foreshadowing overshadowing intrusion into the simple enjoyment and pleasure of sharing among FRIENDS!

Don't bother to comment on what I've said...I shall not answer - you know to whom this msg is addressed!

Peace...

'You Know Who!'
*/

Cynthia Merrill Artis Friday, January 25th 2013 at 11:04PM

ayi yi yi....

Thanks GB.. I was thinking of my grandmother when I posted it... There are three things she passed on to me...... Baking Desserts, The Bible and old traditional Gospel Music...

((sigh.... ☺))

powell robert Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 12:37PM


should Steve and Richard GLORIFY those olde 'whiteMaster' SPIRITUALS they sang in their churches during the greatChristian slaverAmericana era 1492-1864

DAVID JOHNSON Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 12:41PM

ROBERT ,What a racist question damn, you conitue to show disrespect for black people yea you hide real well behind the csp ,,,,this is why I want to send you a ticket to visit LA ,,,GIVE ME A DATE AND TIME THATS BEST FOR YOU <<

DAVID JOHNSON Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 12:42PM

should Steve and Richard GLORIFY those olde 'whiteMaster' SPIRITUALS they sang in their churches during the greatChristian slaverAmericana era 1492-1864


Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 12:37PM
powell robert

Harry Watley Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 1:23PM

i wont post on this blog any more. by yourselves you can not go any where. you need my opposition to see clear.

ROBINSON IRMA Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM

...AND,JUST 'RAPPED THEMSELVES INTO MAKING THE BEST OUT OFA HORRIBLE SITUATION OF BODY AND MIND VIA 'SPIRITUAL UNITY'...THANKS MUCH DOC. (SMILE)

AND, DOC, MY GRANDMOTHER USE TO ALWAYS SAY, "GOD MAY NOT COME WHEN YOU CALL HIM, BUT HE IS ALWAYS ONTIME" (S-M-I-L-E)

ROBINSON IRMA Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM

@HARRY,NOT TO WORRY ABOUT US AFRICAN-AMERICANS OR THE BLACK COMMUNITY...YOU SEE HARRY...A GREAT AND ONE OF OUR OLDEST SPIRITUALS IS, "SWING LOW SWEET CHARIOT"...THIS IS DUE TO THE SLAVE SHIPS BROUGHT US HERE BUT WE WILL HAVE A "SWEET CHARIOT" TO CARRY US BACK HOME TO MOTHER AFRICA...AND I AM SURE THAT, THAT SHIP CALLED "CHARIOT' WILL BE READY LONG BEFORE YOU GET TOTAKE US TO YOUR ALL BLACE AMERICA NATION WITH YOU AS OUR BRAND NEW "MASTER" .LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!!!
(SMILE)

ROBINSON IRMA Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM

YES DOC. I ALSO WOULD LOVE TO RETURN BACK TO THE GOOD OLD DAYS WHEN OUR BLACK CHURCHES WERE THE PILLAR OF OUR BLACK COMMUNITYS AND NOT BIG BUSINESS...

MY MOST FONDEST MEMORYS ARE THOSE FRIDAYNIGHT FISH FRY SANDWICHES...WE GOT TO STAY UP LATE AT MY GRANDMOM'S CHURCH AND PLAY GROWN UP IN HELPING OUT...I REMEMBER GOING AROUND WHEN TIMES WERE REALLY HRD WHEN THE CHURCH NEEDED MAJOR REPAIR OR A FAMILY WAS IN AN UNEXPECTED EMERGANCY, WE HAD THESE SMALL YELLOW ENVVELOPES ASKING FOR NICKELS AND DIMES GOING HOUSE TOHOUSE OR OUT ON TEH STREET WITH STRANGES...THOSE WERE THE DAYS, THOSE WERE THE DAYS OF COMMUNITY UNITY NOT EVERYONE FOR SELF. (SMILE)

AND, BEING ME, MAY I JUST THROW THESE 2 IN...THE COMMUNITY WOULD GATHER TO HELP BUILD /N EIGHBORS HOMES AND AT HOG KILLING TIMES...AT HOG KILLING TIME, I NEVER NOT ENDED UP SICK AS A DOG EATING SKINS FRESH FROM MAKING LARD OUT OF THE BIG BLACK BOILING CAST IORN POT FOR BOILING WHITE OR EXTRA DIRTY CLOTHES AND ALSO FOR MAKING LYE SOAP...YES, THOSE WERE THE DAYS. (SMILE)

GREAT POST MY SISTER IN SPIRIT...(SMILE)

ROBINSON IRMA Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM

...BUILDING / REPARING NEIGHBORS HOMES...(SMILE)...

AND,HARRY SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF HIMSELF...BECAUSE HE SEEM TO BE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE GROWN UP (BACK IN HE GOOD OLD DAYS) WHEN WE STILL LIVED IN TWO GENERATION IF NOT 3 GENERATION HOMES WHERE I AM QUITE SURE HE RECEIVED BETTER HOME TRAINING THAN HE EXIBITS HERE. (NUP!!!)...
AND HARRY YOU NEVER REPLY TOMY COMMENTS, SOPLEASE DON'T DO IT HERE AND IF HE DOES, BUSY BEE JUST DELETE HIM AS I REFUSE TO ALLOW MYSELF TO HELP HIM IN ANY WAY TAKE THIS UNITY BLOG OFF TOPIC. (SMILE)

Cynthia Merrill Artis Wednesday, September 17th 2014 at 11:25PM

April 10th ... She was all over the place pulling up old blogs and posting... My Lady I hope and pray that your spirit is at rest... And I do believe that the spirit exists forever...

DAVID JOHNSON Wednesday, September 17th 2014 at 11:40PM

amen sis

Steve Williams Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 1:34AM

Cynthia, do you know how her comments all got dated April 10? I think you may have been away then.

Cynthia Merrill Artis Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 8:02AM

No Steve how is that? I mean it wasn't too long after that ..she passed away

powell robert Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 8:08AM


ROBERT ,What a racist question damn, you conitue to show disrespect for black people yea you hide real well behind the csp ,,,,this is why I want to send you a ticket to visit LA ,,,GIVE ME A DATE AND TIME THATS BEST FOR YOU

Saturday, January 26th 2013 at 12:41PM
David Johnson

deeJohnson she/he/it---'blackWhiteRedYellow' is of EuroCentric racistIgnorance, paganChristianity

BUT WHAT is your TRASH, other than disrespect!----put a picture on that LIAR

"JESUS ,,THE SLAVE TRANSPORTER.....NOW BLACKS BOW DOWN AND WORSHIP THE SAME JESUS ,,,,WTF "

Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 2:03AM
David Johnson

you COWARDLY Fraud, and ghettoCartoon...............

Steve Williams Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 8:59AM

Cynthia, she was having some trouble with her account, can't remember what, but she gave me her login so I could take a look. But she gave me her PC password instead of BIA password. I thought I was mistyping it, wrong spelling, capitalization, etc., and after a few failed attempts the account self destructed. That's when she had to create a new account, Robinson Irma. Administration was able to restore all her comments but they all got put at the end of the blogs instead of their proper place. I still enjoy rereading them.

Cynthia Merrill Artis Thursday, September 18th 2014 at 6:19PM

Steve thanks... I was thinking about 'the surge'... so that makes sense and I think it's like a special miracle...

Steve Williams Friday, September 19th 2014 at 8:26AM

Yes Cynthia, a special miracle.

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 3:05PM

I'm sorry Robert.... Feel free to express your feelings... I understand your frustration... But I don't understand the anger...you.... Steve... And David are always going at it.. one day there will be total peace in the kingdom for all of us...

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 3:05PM

I'm sorry Robert.... Feel free to express your feelings... I understand your frustration... But I don't understand the anger...you.... Steve... And David are always going at it.. one day there will be total peace in the kingdom for all of us...

powell robert Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 3:45PM


1. is a jew angry at a Nazi?

2.is a deer angry at a lion?

3. is a descendant of slaverAmericana angry at the selfProfessed 'whiteMan' master of racistEvil?

NO, they have a history and the jew has to watch the Nazi, the deer has to be aware of the lion AND all three want to stay away from the Nazi, Lion and redNeck TRASH.....

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 4:42PM

Robert.. ok... I guess there is a whole lot more to the story... Update me please on why Steve is a red neck and the deacon are promoting this slavery master ideologies?

Oh and I agree the deer needs to watch out for the lion...

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 4:46PM

Steve I feel her presence on my blogs.... 😂 tears of joy!

powell robert Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 7:47PM


THE OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALS.....

During the late 18th and early 19th century, many African Americans converted to Christianity,

Posted By: Cynthia Merrill Artis
Friday, January 25th 2013 at 3:52PM

To be an American ONE must be a CITIZEN, the slave was NOT a citizen --- so

there were NO africanAmericans until what 1865-1868?

To convert to something ONE must READ

.....I dare say that 99.479 of all African Slaves in late 18th and early 19th century---had an IQ LOWER than the harry 68IQ RETARDISM.........

they WERE raped, tortured and Murdered As THE OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALS declare into paganChristianity.....

as for the selfProfessed 'whiteMan' at BIA an African American Family site.......

steve has a blaggette, C I V I L I T E R Mortuus

------I discuss it with him thoroughly at that blag

AND

steve agreed with C U R T I S, the selfProfessed 'whiteCountryPreacher' that it is OK to call me a N I G G E R

off course a N I G G E R has its GENESIS with 'whiteMenPaganChristanSlavers' -- they are ***** redNecked racistlyIgnorant TRASH

as for the deaconSoso ---- As THE OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALS declare----bye and bye

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 8:28PM

Robert... I agree... African-American ... Mulatto... Creole.... Octoroon.... Sambo.... All placed on enslaved Africans (whom only identified themselves by tribe or region)- never color!!!! After being enslaved until generations were officially freed in the colonies.

Ori ginally Spirit worship was the first practice form of worship.... Now monotheism was practiced in
Religion which is taught.... We have prophets - ministers-teachers...whom INSTRUCTED .... I grew up a Catholic... Why because that's what I was introduced to... Some intellectual said this is how I should worship.... And added thevirgin Mary into our praise and worship? Roman gods... Greek gods...

My point it doesn't matter Robert....
And All the *****S... Are dead.... They died in the 60's

Steve Williams Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 11:14PM

The free African American citizen Richard Allen converted in the late 18th century. There were many others.

DAVID JOHNSON Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 11:18PM

I JUST WROTE THIS http://wwwtheblogking.blogspot.com/2014/09...

Cynthia Merrill Artis Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 11:47PM

Awesome... I tried to comment but it didn't take....

DAVID JOHNSON Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 12:51AM

the africans are waking up and burning the bible https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=23143...

powell robert Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 9:27PM

you disrespect BIA, hourly ----- you think African Americans are dumb, "whiteMan" steve.....

The free African American citizen Richard Allen converted in the late 18th century. There were many others.
Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 11:14PM
Steve Williams

I JUST WROTE THIS http://wwwtheblogking.blogspot.com/2014/09...

Saturday, September 20th 2014 at 11:18PM
David Johnson

what you just WROTE the LIE that the 'whiteMan' steve gave YOU----Coward, cartoon childSlave



They expanded people's rights through the Fourteenth Amendment (1868), which granted citizenship to all people, including former slaves, born or naturalized in the United States.

Through congressional legislation and ratification of the Fifteenth Amendment, African American men gained the right to vote

LYING, Stereotypically racistlyIgnorant steve ---- LEAVE BIA............

Steve Williams Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 10:17PM

Stop your bull**** history Robert. Richard Allen was an American citizen.

Steve Williams Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 10:42PM

“On December 9, 1830, Richard Allen signed his last official document: a will and testament distributing his considerable real-estate holdings and personal effects among family members. He bequeathed property to nearly a dozen kinfolk. Allen’s longtime home at 150 Spruce Street went to his son John Allen; a multiple-rent-bearing three-story “brick tenement” building and series of lots on Pine Street was divided among his two married daughters, Sarah Eddy and Ann Adams, and his son Peter; and two houses and lots on Lombard Street near Bethel Church were bequeathed to his granddaughter and grandson, Sarah Eddy and Richard Nathaniel Adams, respectively. Allen asked the executors of his estate to sell his country home in Hook, Pennsylvania, after he died, thus defraying any remaining debts.27 Allen’s will also provided rental income and personal property to his “beloved wife,” Sarah, and it allowed the Bethel Church Corp. for a period of ten years to pay only the annual interest on a bond it owed the black bishop. Even Allen’s most cherished personal effects found new homes. To friend Joseph Cox, he gave a “silver head cane and Burkitt’s commentaries on the New Testament”; to black preacher[…]”

Excerpt From: Richard S. Newman. “Freedom’s Prophet.” New York University Press, 2008. iBooks.
This material may be protected by copyright.

Check out this book on the iBooks Store: https://itun.es/us/fXDH0.l

Cynthia Merrill Artis Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 10:50PM

Once upon a time we we were such a happy family.. now just look at us😭😭😭😢... All of this bickering...

Dea. Ron Gray Sr. Sunday, September 21st 2014 at 11:02PM


Sister sing that song... Wow!

powell robert Monday, September 22nd 2014 at 8:02AM


the African free or slave GOT citizenship with the USA Constitution..............1868

you lying BIA flatulent

steveFateAdam-PotHead OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALIST.........

Steve Williams Monday, September 22nd 2014 at 8:56AM

Section 1.

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

This is how you twist history Robert. Show me where, in Pennsylvainia, in 1830, Richard Allen's privileges and immunities were abridged by law, or he was denied due process of law.

Steve Williams Monday, September 22nd 2014 at 8:58AM

Or equal protection of the laws.

powell robert Tuesday, September 23rd 2014 at 8:16PM


1830 constitution still stated African was 3/5ths human being, and 14th and 15th amendment did not pass til 1868 you IGNORANT selfProfessed 'whiteMan' with a 'blackGrandmothersMother'

LEAVE bia you LYING potHead............

Steve Williams Tuesday, September 23rd 2014 at 9:25PM

Wrong again Robert.

powell robert Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 8:22AM


Wrong again Robert.
Tuesday, September 23rd 2014 at 9:25PM
Steve Williams

wrong about the constitution, wrong about your 'whiteSupremist' False agenda at BIA, wrong about YOU being a daily POT user?

what am I wrong about?

--- you racistlyI G N O R A N T potHead with an uncleTom negro set of followes.....


Adam Fate Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 8:29AM

Wrong about the United States of America.

Siebra Muhammad Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 6:53PM

Cynthia did you check out the video of these three sisters performing the song? These sisters can sang!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vjq2oKevKh0

powell robert Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 8:43PM



THE OLD NEGRO SPIRITUALS.....

Wrong about the United States of America.
Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 8:29AM
Adam Fate

is it steve or fate: jackarse................

so TRUTH means nothing to the selfProfessed 'whiteMan' as Fate or willie JUST 'whitePrivilidge'


The Constitution of the United States

Preamble Note

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Amendment 13 - Slavery Abolished. Ratified 12/6/1865. History
1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

Amendment 14 - Citizenship Rights. Ratified 7/9/1868. Note History
1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice-President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.
3. No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.
5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.

Amendment 15 - Race No Bar to Vote. Ratified 2/3/1870. History
1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.

has steve left BIA - fate or reincarnated one, give him this USA CONSTITUTION...........


Adam Fate Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 9:39PM

Back to Richard Allen. Since Pennsylvainia, 1830, already was in conformance with amendment 14, Richard Allen was a citizen of both the State of Pennsylvainia and the United States of America.

powell robert Thursday, September 25th 2014 at 8:10AM

.
Back to Richard Allen. Since Pennsylvainia, 1830, already was in conformance with amendment 14, Richard Allen was a citizen of both the State of Pennsylvainia and the United States of America.
Wednesday, September 24th 2014 at 9:39PM
Adam Fate

Amendment 14 was in 1868 --- your brother Richard Allen lived in 1830---is that past, present or future?

you lying racistPotHead, leave BIA

Cynthia Merrill Artis Thursday, September 25th 2014 at 12:23PM

I know there is a teaching moment among this debate. .. right? ?

Adam Fate Thursday, September 25th 2014 at 12:54PM

There is for me. I don't know about Robert.

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